Originally posted by Erlangernick It’s a deal. When can you send them over? |
Originally posted by InvalidStout Yes, I’ll do a swapsie with you, btw Invalidstout he never mentioned Scottish cask breweries so I guess that your offer is null & void |
Originally posted by SaintMatty Yes, I wrote it in one of my regular columns. Here is an extract: Has CAMRA stunted the growth of British beer? We British are an island people. We may know more of the world beyond our shores than our Americans counterparts but then we live in a smaller place. Like goldfish in a bowl, we have little sense of proportion. We know what we like and don’t like and we don’t like change. The Campaign for Real Ale (CAMRA) was a singularly British idea, dreamt up in 1971 by four young journalists holidaying in Ireland. Fantasizing as young men do about making the world a better place, they decided to start with beer. The ‘60s had seen mass movements to counter war, poverty, famine and injustice. The ‘70s would be about changing the day-to-day. Dull 1970s beer was about to be squeezed back to the future. There had been consumerism in food and drink before CAMRA .... a single-issue campaign. Its simple message was, “Old beer good – new beer bad”. In this context ‘old’ meant cask-fermented ales served with no added CO2, served usually straight from the barrel or hand-pulled to the bar counter. Such ales became ‘real’, while the rest acquired less wholesome names, including ‘foreign’. This began a patchwork global uprising that saw Charlie Papazian and others home-brew great beer back into the US mainstream and spawned a dozen national beer drinker groups across Europe. The global brewpub and microbrewery revolution had begun. But then the awkward question. Has CAMRA fallen victim to the law of unintended consequences? By deifying a limited range of virtually unexportable ale styles, did CAMRA fossilise British beer culture in a spoof version of the 1950s? What stops me admitting this is so? Sentimentality? Everyone should waste a substantial part of their youth on a hopeless cause. Mine was beer – though we won! Or maybe it is because the proposition is only half true. CAMRA’s double standard of tolerating abhorrent grain and hop substitutions while maintaining an autistic stance on fermentation offends all logic. I get deeply embarrassed when the Great British Beer Festival refuses to use CO2 on any beer because it might offend campaigners, regardless of whether the beer is designed to be recarbonated. The failure to challenge the narrow British obsession with beers drunk in measures of 20 fl. oz. Imperial is galling too. On the other hand find any quality website about beer and CAMRA-inspired Brits will be there, enthusing away. And even the smallest CAMRA-run festival nowadays sells ‘foreign beers’. The last three decades have seen consumers generally kicking against the standardisation of food and drink by global corporations. CAMRA started beer’s contribution to that, so maybe we should forgive its occasional spats of xenophobic myopia? Maybe. Recent surveys report a massive increase in the proportion of British drinkers who have given ‘real ale’ a try – 38 years after it was first suggested. Over half now take the plunge. With the alternatives reduced to a shallow range of piss poor grain sodas, who knows, uncarbonated draft may yet become the UK’s favourite style. Maybe a bunch of young British journalists holidaying in Belgium, Gemany or the US could start a group to campaign for more foreign influence on UK craft brewing? What a splendid idea. I might even join. |
Thanks for the extract Tim. Of course, now I’ve been enlightenmed by Mr Valentine, I can safely ignore all that as you are now a "once-respected" beer writer. And there was I making the mistake of "respecting" what you write. Must get hold of some of Mr Valentine’s books and writings to see how it’s done properly, or should I say "respectably". |
Originally posted by SamGamgee You’re right. I should have used "live" instead of "fresh". The two terms got conflated in my mind. I have used "fresh" on several forums on this debate when what I meant all along was "live". I don’t think I’m that bothered to go back and change them all.... |
I wonder how CAMRA gets on at EBCU meetings? Ah, I have at least a partial answer on that one. They have a sensible - at least - if maybe not entirely honest (that’s putting it mildly) way of forwarding the more moderate, sensible people for contacting all those bl**dy foreigners who are at home in that infernal Brussels, as Terry Lock, Iain Loe,... |
Originally posted by InvalidStout Also interesting: MOTION 12 - Defeated Amended - This Conference recognises the importance of beer festivals to CAMRA in promoting real ale, real cider and real perry. As such, it encourages the Organisers of CAMRA beer festivals not to offer to the public, either directly or indirectly, alcoholic drinks other than real ale, real cider and real perry. Quality bottled beers from overseas countries that do not have a "Real Ale in a Bottle" tradition may be allowed at the Festival Organisers’ discretion. Proposed by Ron Elder Seconded by Roger Preece |
Originally posted by JorisPPattyn I think there has been some misunderstanding going on Joris. Your remarks seem to imply that you feel that the chairman was speaking on behalf of the membership to the general public. He was not. He was speaking as an individual to CAMRA members. And as an individual he seemed quite angry about stuff he had been reading where people were suggesting that CAMRA should promote keg beer. He was giving his personal reaction to that, and his personal position as chairman. If the members don’t agree with his position they can vote him out. He was, it seems, initially provoked by a little known article in the BA magazine. It would be useful to see that article, and if somebody could scan it and upload it somewhere that would be great. I don’t quite follow your comment that beer bloggers are in no position to defend themselves! I think it has been the beer bloggers who have brought his speech to the attention of the general beer community. I first became aware of it from FaceBook links to Martyn’s blog, though other bloggers have also covered the story - some supportive of CAMRA. |
Originally posted by SilkTork He was, it seems, initially provoked by a little known article in the BA magazine. It would be useful to see that article, and if somebody could scan it and upload it somewhere that would be great. Tim Webb has already pasted the article above :) |
Originally posted by SilkTork Oh, I thought that was his Chairman’s address. Obviously, I don’t know how the CAMRA national executive committee / full time staff run things but, having been involved in chairing and speaking on behalf of executive committees at conferences a fair few times in my union days, there was usually a "line to take" agreed collectively for this sort of thing. Certainly, in my experience, executive committee members, chairman or otherwise, were not allowed to speak in a personal capacity. Or, at least, if they did it would be regarded as a serious breach of protocol. |
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