Fremont The Ancient One

Reads 2252 • Replies 22 • Started Thursday, September 1, 2016 10:57:26 PM CT

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Message beastiefan2k P beers 5012 º places 294 º 13:21 Thu 9/8/2016 Originally posted by after4ever When their beers go for 10-20 times that much on the aftermarket wait, what? people know/like Fremont outside of Seattle? Why am I so out of touch?
Message Sarlacc83 beers 2662 º places 111 º 13:34 Thu 9/8/2016 Originally posted by craftycarl21 Originally posted by after4ever Originally posted by craftycarl21 Fremont has some serious gall to charge that much for that volume of their beer. When their beers go for 10-20 times that much on the aftermarket and all the profit goes to scalpers, why would they NOT charge that much for a beer with so much development time and cost? I hate how much beers cost now, too, but 1,000,000 times out of 1,000,000, I’d prefer the money go to the people whose skill and effort delivered the beer, rather than to some release-day line pirate. I totally agree with the sentiment, but an instance of gouging the consumer by a more deserving party cannot be justified by the existence of gouging by a less deserving one. Furthermore, who’s to say that 10-20 aftermarket multiplier won’t still exist at the higher initial price point? It’s not gouging. You are free to not buy it. And given how insane some collectors are, I see no problem taking what you can get. (And less capitalistically, high price drives down demand so those same Bros are less likely to get mules.)
Message craftycarl21 beers 2338 º places 93 º 14:32 Thu 9/8/2016 Originally posted by Sarlacc83 Originally posted by craftycarl21 Originally posted by after4ever Originally posted by craftycarl21 Fremont has some serious gall to charge that much for that volume of their beer. When their beers go for 10-20 times that much on the aftermarket and all the profit goes to scalpers, why would they NOT charge that much for a beer with so much development time and cost? I hate how much beers cost now, too, but 1,000,000 times out of 1,000,000, I’d prefer the money go to the people whose skill and effort delivered the beer, rather than to some release-day line pirate. I totally agree with the sentiment, but an instance of gouging the consumer by a more deserving party cannot be justified by the existence of gouging by a less deserving one. Furthermore, who’s to say that 10-20 aftermarket multiplier won’t still exist at the higher initial price point? It’s not gouging. You are free to not buy it. And given how insane some collectors are, I see no problem taking what you can get. (And less capitalistically, high price drives down demand so those same Bros are less likely to get mules.) I understand the capitalist premise, supply/demand, etc. That doesn’t mean it’s not gouging. All I’m saying (admittedly not too clearly) is that operating under this sort of logic can be a very slippery slope that can alienate a pretty legitimate subset of a brewery’s customers. Just because there are wealthy fanatics who can afford high prices does not mean you aren’t pricing out other people. "You are free not to buy it" is a dangerous business model from a company’s point of view. I guess I’m just saying that’s over the line for me personally; where does it fall for other people? Is it OK for Hill Farmstead or insert highly sought after brewery to charge $90/bottle if they still sell out?

Message after4ever P admin beers 8025 º places 322 º 14:45 Thu 9/8/2016 Originally posted by beastiefan2k Originally posted by after4ever When their beers go for 10-20 times that much on the aftermarket wait, what? people know/like Fremont outside of Seattle? Why am I so out of touch? Yeah, I no longer trade, but, hanging out with traders, I’ve cracked bottles lately that included some super-hyped danksauce walezbrah, and they all came back for Fremont bottles. B-Bombs, Rusty Nails, etc. They’re a big deal, though maybe not a colossal deal. Back to the main topic, I do totally get why people hate the prices spiraling up, but it’s just weird to look at rising prices and say "it’s a bad business model," or "it’s a dangerous precedent," or "they’re being unfair to some beer lovers" when the trend is clearly, overwhelmingly toward beers like this selling out every single time within a day. And then going for insane prices on the grey/black market. How can anyone look at that reality and say "you’re a bad person/bad businessperson unless you charge me less"? I think it would be cool of them to offer more modestly-priced receptacles of Ancient for on-site consumption only, but I can’t in good conscience ask them to give it all away to the pirates. We’re still not seeing anything remotely close to the price points that the top wineries get every year.
Message douglas88 P admin beers 13196 º places 398 º 00:38 Fri 9/9/2016 $30 per 375 mL bottle is absurd. The fact that some people will pay it doesn’t change that. Even if it was a 750, that’s a lot. I agree that they can charge whatever they want, and that people would buy bottles at 50$. But prices like that feed the hype machine and also create an exclusivity to beer that isn’t great.
Message after4ever P admin beers 8025 º places 322 º 01:19 Fri 9/9/2016 Originally posted by douglas88 $30 per 375 mL bottle is absurd. The fact that some people will pay it doesn’t change that. Even if it was a 750, that’s a lot. I agree that they can charge whatever they want, and that people would buy bottles at 50$. But prices like that feed the hype machine and also create an exclusivity to one beer that matters almost exclusively to hardcore geeks that isn’t great, but won’t affect the attitudes of 99+% of non-macro beer drinkers. I sincerely believe that this is closer to the truth.
Message bitbucket beers 2166 º places 63 º 12:58 Fri 9/9/2016 I’m all for the brewer getting the money rather than the grey/black market. I remember standing in line for hours at Hair of the Dog, only to ALMOST get some of their beer. after4ever probably remembers this as well. I still wonder how much of the beer purchased that day was meant for private consumption and/or a few trades as opposed to being a money-making resale opportunity. The HOTD dock sales were great back in the day when they actually sold beer from their dock, but once their reputation got large enough it became not worth the trouble for me.

Message andrewje41 P beers 7597 º places 142 º 18:58 Sat 9/10/2016 An update on the situation. I attended the release, and arrived 50 minutes before the doors opened. They handed out tokens for the bottles for those who were in line, all of which were spoken for when I arrived, so I opted for the draft only line which was about two dozen folks long. They say the bottles will be distributed, however each receiving vendor will be receiving a case of 6 bottles. What a bottle shop will choose to do with 6 bottles will be interesting to me. More like a contest to see who is willing to hold on to it the longest before releasing it, in my opinion. The term "Very limited" on this bottle, is an extreme exaggeration, which I expected it to be on the other side, but this isn’t the first time I was wrong about something like this. It looks like the draft was hanging on by a thread when I left the brewery at 1:00, and the Dark Star had already kicked, so I’m sure it’s gone by now. Great beer, but overall surprised that it ended up being this extremely limited.
Message Amfo beers 20 º places 1 º 20:35 Sat 9/10/2016 I got there at 11 and they had already capped the bottle line. Went in and had both on draft. I liked the B Bomb better than Dark Star. Smoother, chocolate notes. Dark Star was a little hot and more astringent in the finish. Both good but not $30 for 375 mL good. At one point a guy behind my group hit his bag off his table and one of his bottles shattered. Everyone felt super bad for the dude. Kudos to Fremont for replacing the bottle.
Message Sarlacc83 beers 2662 º places 111 º 21:16 Sat 9/10/2016 Originally posted by craftycarl21 Originally posted by Sarlacc83 Originally posted by craftycarl21 Originally posted by after4ever Originally posted by craftycarl21 Fremont has some serious gall to charge that much for that volume of their beer. When their beers go for 10-20 times that much on the aftermarket and all the profit goes to scalpers, why would they NOT charge that much for a beer with so much development time and cost? I hate how much beers cost now, too, but 1,000,000 times out of 1,000,000, I’d prefer the money go to the people whose skill and effort delivered the beer, rather than to some release-day line pirate. I totally agree with the sentiment, but an instance of gouging the consumer by a more deserving party cannot be justified by the existence of gouging by a less deserving one. Furthermore, who’s to say that 10-20 aftermarket multiplier won’t still exist at the higher initial price point? It’s not gouging. You are free to not buy it. And given how insane some collectors are, I see no problem taking what you can get. (And less capitalistically, high price drives down demand so those same Bros are less likely to get mules.) I understand the capitalist premise, supply/demand, etc. That doesn’t mean it’s not gouging. All I’m saying (admittedly not too clearly) is that operating under this sort of logic can be a very slippery slope that can alienate a pretty legitimate subset of a brewery’s customers. Just because there are wealthy fanatics who can afford high prices does not mean you aren’t pricing out other people. "You are free not to buy it" is a dangerous business model from a company’s point of view. I guess I’m just saying that’s over the line for me personally; where does it fall for other people? Is it OK for Hill Farmstead or insert highly sought after brewery to charge $90/bottle if they still sell out? Yes. They are free to charge that much. Wine does. What you are really saying is that you don’t want Fremont to alienate their market - especially you - and that’s fine and fair. It’s a mistake to cast it otherwise however. Breweries don’t owe us anything but it’s nice to think they care enough not to dive that deep into our pockets. Some will and I don’t blame them. Others don’t and I try to support them.