Update and two questions.
Five days after pitching lacto I took a sample. I now know exactly what the garbage smell is that people referred to. Will this smell go away?
OG: 1.029
Gravity at 5 days: 1.024
Is this normal for Lacto? I pitched at 105F, by about 12 hours later the temp had dropped to around 75F. I know it works best at the warmer temps, but I don’t have a way of maintaining warm temps right now.
Thanks |
Most lacto wont eat the maltose (primary sugar in wort), only the glucose (a much smaller proportion of the fermentation in wort) so a small decrease in gravity isn’t unexpected if that is the only bug in there.
EDIT- I should make sure I clarify: L. delbruekii subspecies b. is what most of the "commercial" lacto strains are listed as. To my knowledge, they will really only go after glucose. |
Originally posted by sharpe1987
In my search I also saw someone who suggested "floating" sedan wrap on top of the beer to minimize oxygen exposure. Seemed like a good idea, we’ll see how it works.
Do this regularly when making wine at home along with a CO2 blanket after ferment as extended maceration. Has worked well for years but no scientific controls here just anecdotes. |
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Originally posted by CLevar
Most lacto wont eat the maltose (primary sugar in wort), only the glucose (a much smaller proportion of the fermentation in wort) so a small decrease in gravity isn’t unexpected if that is the only bug in there.
EDIT- I should make sure I clarify: L. delbruekii subspecies b. is what most of the "commercial" lacto strains are listed as. To my knowledge, they will really only go after glucose.
I used the White Labs L. delbruekii strain. Not sure about which subspecies it is. Pitched Brett Brux 5 days after pitching Lacto. Hoping this will attenuate the rest of the way. Kind of wonder how it will do in an anaerobic environment. |
Originally posted by sharpe1987
Originally posted by CLevar
Most lacto wont eat the maltose (primary sugar in wort), only the glucose (a much smaller proportion of the fermentation in wort) so a small decrease in gravity isn’t unexpected if that is the only bug in there.
EDIT- I should make sure I clarify: L. delbruekii subspecies b. is what most of the "commercial" lacto strains are listed as. To my knowledge, they will really only go after glucose.
I used the White Labs L. delbruekii strain. Not sure about which subspecies it is. Pitched Brett Brux 5 days after pitching Lacto. Hoping this will attenuate the rest of the way. Kind of wonder how it will do in an anaerobic environment.
If you look at papers from the 40’s and 50’s, early characterization of lacto species and strains could be done based on their carbohydrate utilization; Strains unable to ferment certain sugars (like maltose) got classified as "delbruekii". This classification tends to hold even now when more phylogenetic tools are used...meaning that if it said "delbruekii" (even if not subspecies bulgaricus), it likely won’t eat maltose.
Brett does just fine in a completely anaerobic environment, especially if what you want is fermentation to EtOH rather than to acetic acid... |
Originally posted by theothermatt
I found that it’s easier to sour mash. Mash like you would and it goes straight into a carboy, drop it to 100 and pitch Wyeast 5335 Lacto. It will sour but not ferment. Leave it for 5 days at as close to 100F as you can, then move into boil kettle and boil for 15 minutes. Crash and pitch a clean fermenting yeast.
When did you start brewing, especially Berliners?
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Originally posted by drowland
Originally posted by theothermatt
I found that it’s easier to sour mash. Mash like you would and it goes straight into a carboy, drop it to 100 and pitch Wyeast 5335 Lacto. It will sour but not ferment. Leave it for 5 days at as close to 100F as you can, then move into boil kettle and boil for 15 minutes. Crash and pitch a clean fermenting yeast.
When did you start brewing, especially Berliners?
Last summer.  |
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I think I’ve posted this before but here’s how I’ve made most of my Berliner-type sours:
It’s sort of a variation on a sour mash. Mash as normal, drain the wort. Empty the mash tun of grain, and return the hot wort to the tun with a handful of grain. Leave to sour to taste, then boil and off you go as normal.
The advantage of this over a normal sour mash is that you don’t have to deal with a sparge that takes aeons, and you don’t have to deal with a big smelly pile of lacto-fermented grains. You do run an additional risk of oxygen getting into it, but you can help minimize this by purging things with Co2 (which, actually, I can’t do at the moment). I also have a metal tube coming down about 1.5 feet from my mash tun which stops wort soaring through the air and splashing on things.
I’ve made a good number of beers this way, one I got an award for, and never had a problem.
If you do get butyric acid, apparently brett will eventually munch it into some rather pleasant, tropical aromatic compounds, so although it’s not ideal, time should fix it.
EDIT: Another important thing to do is to use some acidulated malt to drop your mash pH to about 4.5. This should help discourage things other than lacto.
It should also help with head retention, since the proteolytic enzymes lacto produces, which rip up the middle-sized proteins involved in head retention, are much less active at this sort of pH. |
