Admin hat on.
Hopefully we can keep the whole discussion nice and friendly. We will all have hopes and expectations to how the vote will pan out.
Not for us to advise one way or the other, even though most of us who are currently part of the union won’t be getting a vote on our future. Oops, sorry, that may have been political. |
Originally posted by evilempire
However, don’t forget a lot of the propoganda from the Yes lobby is just that. There’s things they don’t tell you - for example, the whole thing about free university education for Scottish students... not only is that currently funded by taxpayers in the whole of the UK,
Scotland, via the Barnett formula, gets higher per-capita public spending than the rUK average, but even with this, Scotland has been a net contributor to the UK for the last 30 years. So although Scotland’s free university education (as well as all our other public services) is paid for by a grant from the UK government, and so, in a sense, funded by rUK taxpayers, it is not *subsidised* by rUK tax, and would be just as affordable (in fact, more so) if we were independent.
but what you have to bear in mind is that post independence English students will be entitled to study for free at Scottsih universities as long as Scottish students are, and it will be illegal to discriminate.
Actually, I don’t think those English students make up a terribly financially significant portion of students at Scottish unis. Certainly nowhere near as important as non-EU students. Actually, its unclear whether the discrepancy would be legal post-independence. Some think it would be. I can’t remember the paper, I’m sure google would help. Anyway, I don’t think we should charge English students extra just on moral grounds.
Similarly, if Scotland decides not to pay its share of national debt, not only will the UK be likely to also withhold assets, but also it will be seen internationally as a debt default, and the cost of borrowing in Scotland could well go through the roof
This is what Better Together and their media lackeys like to say, but it’s very far from obvious that this would be so. It’s the rUK governments debt. They’ve signed up for it as the continuing state. I actually think, after the McCrone report cover-up and subsequent squandering of Scotland’s wealth, that rUK taking the national debt is the least they can do. Plenty of others think we’re under a moral obligation to pay it - conditional on it being agreed during reasonable negotiations. But I doubt international investors give a shit about this debate. I’ve yet to see any case made that they care about anything other than that the country with its name on the forms pays when they’re supposed to.
Back to beer... The existing Scottish beer industry can thrive but there’s potential for winners and losers (as ever). It will be harder for Scottish brewers to export to England, but also harder for English beer to come north (replace ’harder’ with ’more inconvenient’ if you wish). So, the home market could grow, while the export market could shrink. Tax rates could make further differences - if Scotland sets significantly different corporation tax rates to England, businesses are likely to cross the border accordingly
The SNP don’t want to raise corporation tax, though who knows what the views will be of the 2016 government. I suspect it won’t happen, at least initially. I don’t think the UK beer market is that relevantly different from the rest of the world, so I think the success of other small independent countries beer-wise gives us reason to think it won’t make much of a difference. |
Originally posted by imdownthepub
Not for us to advise one way or the other, even though most of us who are currently part of the union won’t be getting to decide Scotland’s future on its behalf. Oops, sorry, that may have been political.
Fixed it for you. 
Srsly though, this is probably a bit OT-M now, so I shall bow out before I get even rantier. |
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The laws on alcohol in scotland are very strict, so if anything id imagine duty will go up further and make the scene even harder for brewers. |
Originally posted by GarethYoung
Originally posted by imdownthepub
Not for us to advise one way or the other, even though most of us who are currently part of the union won’t be getting to decide Scotland’s future on its behalf. Oops, sorry, that may have been political.
Fixed it for you.
Don’t get me wrong here, I (we) would seriously be in the Yes camp. |
Originally posted by imdownthepub
Originally posted by GarethYoung
Originally posted by imdownthepub
Not for us to advise one way or the other, even though most of us who are currently part of the union won’t be getting to decide Scotland’s future on its behalf. Oops, sorry, that may have been political.
Fixed it for you.
Don’t get me wrong here, I (we) would seriously be in the Yes camp.
 |
Originally posted by GarethYoung
Actually, I don’t think those English students make up a terribly financially significant portion of students at Scottish unis. Certainly nowhere near as important as non-EU students. Actually, its unclear whether the discrepancy would be legal post-independence. Some think it would be. I can’t remember the paper, I’m sure google would help. Anyway, I don’t think we should charge English students extra just on moral grounds
not now, no - because English students have a choice of paying £9k a year in England, or £9k a year in Scotland. But, under EU law, an independent Scotland wouldn’t be allowed to discriminate against English students whether they wanted to or not, so English students would have a cchoice between paying £9k a year in England or £0 in scotland - this may have an effect on demand!
(ok, that was my last political post, and comes about purely cos I work in a university and this is something we’re having to take into account at the moment)
anyway, back on topic - do I have to retrospectively move my thousands of Scottish beer ticks from my UK list to my Foreign Muck list? or can I count them on both if I drink them again  |
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Originally posted by evilempire
Originally posted by GarethYoung
Actually, I don’t think those English students make up a terribly financially significant portion of students at Scottish unis. Certainly nowhere near as important as non-EU students. Actually, its unclear whether the discrepancy would be legal post-independence. Some think it would be. I can’t remember the paper, I’m sure google would help. Anyway, I don’t think we should charge English students extra just on moral grounds
not now, no - because English students have a choice of paying £9k a year in England, or £9k a year in Scotland. But, under EU law, an independent Scotland wouldn’t be allowed to discriminate against English students whether they wanted to or not, so English students would have a cchoice between paying £9k a year in England or £0 in scotland - this may have an effect on demand!
(ok, that was my last political post, and comes about purely cos I work in a university and this is something we’re having to take into account at the moment)
anyway, back on topic - do I have to retrospectively move my thousands of Scottish beer ticks from my UK list to my Foreign Muck list? or can I count them on both if I drink them again
Under the assumption that Scotland would "be allowed" to join the EU at some point! |
Originally posted by evilempire
Originally posted by GarethYoung
Actually, I don’t think those English students make up a terribly financially significant portion of students at Scottish unis. Certainly nowhere near as important as non-EU students. Actually, its unclear whether the discrepancy would be legal post-independence. Some think it would be. I can’t remember the paper, I’m sure google would help. Anyway, I don’t think we should charge English students extra just on moral grounds
not now, no - because English students have a choice of paying £9k a year in England, or £9k a year in Scotland. But, under EU law, an independent Scotland wouldn’t be allowed to discriminate against English students whether they wanted to or not, so English students would have a cchoice between paying £9k a year in England or £0 in scotland - this may have an effect on demand!
(ok, that was my last political post, and comes about purely cos I work in a university and this is something we’re having to take into account at the moment)
anyway, back on topic - do I have to retrospectively move my thousands of Scottish beer ticks from my UK list to my Foreign Muck list? or can I count them on both if I drink them again
Doesn’t matter. Unless you input them on to this website then they count for fuck all. |
The key question for me - is there any chance McEwans will once again be brewed in Scotland if there is a yes vote....? |
