Lacto

So I made a Berliner about 2 years ago with a pure wyeast lacto pack for 3 days in the laundry room (maybe 85ish degrees). I then pitched sacch three days later. It took about the entire two years to sour up to a point I like. Anyway, I swore off lacto beers after that. Fast forward to today. I was at a brewery and they had an AWESOME Gose. I talked to the brewer and he said he stepped up omega lacto blend. And he used it only in the kettle. He said it soured up in about 12 hours. Anyone else ever use this stuff? I only found one website that had it in stock so I ordered some. I hope to brew a Gose in a couple weeks.

I have it sitting in my fridge right now. I have not used it yet, but one of the strains in that mix has been gaining a lot of attraction for kettle soured beers.

There really isn’t any reason Lacto can’t get a kettle soured beer down to a pH of 3.3-3.5 in a short amount of time. Pitch enough cells, keep the temperature where Lacto is happy, and keep yeast out.

I’ve heard a lot of people get excited about the Omega lacto blend, so it’s probably worth a bash. But bear in mind that those sort of times for kettle souring are standard, and should be acheivable with any lacto strain suitable for kettle souring.

The very fast souring strain that everyone is excited about is Lactobacillus Plantarum, which a lot of probiotic pills contain. I haven’t tried it myself, but apparently you can get good results by just cracking in a ton of probiotic pills. So you could try that, as well as the Omega blend, which also contains Plantarum.

As Caleb says, just pitch lots of cells, hit the right temperature and you should be jamming.

EDIT: By ’as well as’, I didn’t mean you should stick them all in the same beer (though that would work too), just that the pills are worth a shot, if you like the Omega blend.

Yeah, the Omega blend contains L. plantarum, which is very hyped at the moment. I’m kegging a sour grissette later today which I sour worted with this strain which I cultured from probiotic juice shots (ProViva Superfrukt). Did starters in two steps from 300 ml of juice. Got down to pH 3.2-3.3ish in 21h at about 34 degrees Centigrade. Flushed with CO2 prior to souring. The beer is very promising, has a clean and lactic sourness. No real off flavours.

Originally posted by Homer321
It took about the entire two years to sour up to a point I like. Anyway, I swore off lacto beers after that.

I have had great results just using a handful of 2-row to kettle sour beers, as opposed to spending extra money on lacto cultures.

Originally posted by sj3324
I have had great results just using a handful of 2-row to kettle sour beers, as opposed to spending extra money on lacto cultures.

Originally posted by GarethYoung

Originally posted by sj3324
I have had great results just using a handful of 2-row to kettle sour beers, as opposed to spending extra money on lacto cultures.

This works too, but you need to make a starter (with pH dropped by a little lactic acid), then pitch the starter. If you don’t, you’ll risk off flavours, and the souring process will take too long.

Originally posted by GarethYoung

Originally posted by sj3324
I have had great results just using a handful of 2-row to kettle sour beers, as opposed to spending extra money on lacto cultures.

This works too, but you need to make a starter (with pH dropped by a little lactic acid), then pitch the starter. If you don’t, you’ll risk off flavours, and the souring process will take too long.

I’ve had delicious, clean beers made by sour mashing, as well as by adding grain directly to the kettle to kettle sour, but I’ve also had a lot of such beers with seriously bad off-flavours. It’s just not a reliable way of making good sour beers.

24-36 hours is fast for this method (it often takes 3-4 days), but even then it’s not fast enough for me. I don’t like anything more than 12 hours, and I try to get it done within 8 hours. Partly because it’s safer from off-flavours, and partly because I want to minimise contact time between the proteins and the proteolytic enzymes that destroy them, ruining head-retention and mouthfeel.

Always better to add a large starter, either grown from grains (and checking for any off-flavours), or from a commercial culture. If you add a big starter with all the liquid, it has the added benefit of putting a lot of lactobacillus cells in your wort and dropping the pH at the same time.

Originally posted by NobleSquirrel

Originally posted by GarethYoung

Originally posted by sj3324
I have had great results just using a handful of 2-row to kettle sour beers, as opposed to spending extra money on lacto cultures.

This works too, but you need to make a starter (with pH dropped by a little lactic acid), then pitch the starter. If you don’t, you’ll risk off flavours, and the souring process will take too long.

Yeah, it will sour, but it won’t make a controlled beer. That’s the concern, IMO. There’s a reason that commercial brewers aren’t brewing using native microflora on the grain...